Star Trek: Picard

[Blake00]

You're back! Been trying to get on this site for a day or so now and was starting to get worried you'd bitten the bullet! Although you guys have been posting away over the last few days so I wonder what went wrong for me..

Episode 10..

Spoiler

Kinda glad its all over as in these last few weeks it felt like I was just waiting for them to find new ways to disappoint me lol. Now that it's done I don't have to worry about it lol.

So.. that last episode.. once again we've got some good things but mostly things that annoyed me lol..

I enjoyed the Picard noble sacrifice to save Soji (from her fears) scene.. tugged on the old heart strings a bit so well done there. Was also nice to see Picard flying a ship and being himself a bit more instead of the usual helpless old man in the back seat stuff. Liked the Picard maneuver (the ship one not the shirt one lol) reference too..

Sure enough my prediction of Picard becoming an android, or more accurately an organic synthetic came true. Felt a bit weird though as lets face it, it's kinda like cloning in that they made an electronic copy of his mind meaning the Picard we know and love has just actually died lol. Not really sure how to feel about that other than it sucks a bit.

People who may remember my earlier posts here will know that my hope was that this series was all about resurrecting Data and undoing the damage Nemesis did. I was almost willing to accept all the other BS that had happened if that was the target. So I really hoped the golum would be for him and not a quick Picard resurrection. So when Picard bought it I knew what was coming...

But then he woke up in the simulation and there was data saying exactly what I had posted in previous posts that I'd hoped would happen. They combined those residual Data memories Maddox had generated for his synths with B4's backup of Data's brain to make a pretty much complete resurrected Data (from the moment he did the transfer a day or so before his death in Nemesis). I was so excited! The moment I'd been waiting for! But of course this is a Michael Chabon show and he wants to make Star Trek and its fans as miserable as possible lol so naturally a matter of seconds later this amazing resurrection that so many of us had dreamed of happening for almost 20 damn years was shown to be nothing more than a tease because Data asks to die. Picard then mercy kills him just like 7 of 9 mercy killed Icheb. Michael watched his father suffer & die slowly on life support while writing these new shows which is a horrible thing to go through (I dread having to go through something like that with my mother) and unfortunately all this stuff is probably him creatively dealing with that pain but unfortunately he's dealing with it using the Star Trek universe and characters loved by millions people. I get it, they wanted to give a data 'beautiful death' instead of the cheap one he got in Nemesis hence why I've seen people out there touched and happy with it. But as someone who pretty much was dying (pun not intended lol) to watch this series believing it was all gonna be about Data's resurrection I feel cheated. To tease him being back like that only to take him away just makes me wanna hop over to Michael's twitter and throw some 4 letter words his way (I won't though cause I don't wanna be a d*ck lol). Judging by this article he wouldn't care anyway and for those excited that he's not the main guy behind season 2 well guess what, that article confirms he's written 2 eps and also brainstormed the other 8 for season 2.. so yeah expect more attempts to make us miserable (if we watch) in the future lol.

I wish they could have brought Data back.. yes I'm not stupid.. I know Brent doesn't exact look like Data anymore hence the mountain of makeup and weird camera angles of him sitting or standing to hide his belly making it half impossible to have him around all the time. However they could have brought him back and then have him go back to starfleet or earth or go on his own ventures or something. You know just send him off into the galaxy with happy "All Good Things" like moment to finish his ark. Let us fans think of him living on forever going on adventures and continuing his question to evolve. Let that be the last thing we see of him.. not him dying AGAIN. The face growing old (doesn't make any sense unless they programmed the event) and a virtual duplicate Picard in the red uniform standing over him, even though Picard had been extracted already (another copy lol??) all painted to give a beautiful death triggering an emotional response that makes some forget the weirdness and lack of science and sense behind it lol. However there's nothing stopping them from resurrecting Data again so screw you Michael I'm going to choose to believe that Dr Soon Jr Jr Jr Jr being the sneaky guy he is backed up another copy of Data's mind, waited for Picard to leave then stuck Data in another golum and now he's out there living happily every after lol. Picard's "my gain is your loss line" implies Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr can't make another golum but get stuffed.. Maddox did the brains and Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr did the bodies, nothing stopping him from making more lol.

Anyway back to Picard's death and resurrection wtf was with them rush skipping over most of the casts reaction to him being back again. Once again Michael's story telling has us in pain watching everyone cry for like 10 damn minutes and then doesn't bother to cover everyone seeing him alive again except for Dr Death, Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr and Soji. Literally straight back on the ship like nothing happened lol.

Speaking of that final ship scene I've seen some people confusingly posting "are Raffi and 7 of 9 lovers?" well that 2nd article I linked I linked to above has Michael confirming it.. action jackson 7 of 9 had a thing with that crime lord chick she vaporized and she's got a thing with Raffi or whatever her name is (I just cannot remember these new cast member names haha), so expect more of the stuff we've seen from Discovery in Picard season 2 (poor Chakotay haha). I'll leave that for others to debate the merits of all that as it doesn't really bother me, other than to say I find their 'all or nothing' approach a bit weird as does this mean the other shows coming (ST Section 31, ST Pike, ST Lower Decks) will do the same?

Oh and speaking of 7 of 9.. how did the Romulan evil chick get back on the cube to fight 7 of 9??? she left the cube with the fleet several eps ago didn't she???

I saw some article a few days ago which I can't seem to find now sorry but it talked about plans for a crossover series that would involve casts members from all the different new trek shows.. pretty much the marvel avengers of new star trek lol. I really don't know how to feel about that lol. I mean if this had been 30 years ago and we had Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway and Archer and other cast members all in one big crossover event series that would have been epic (hell I think there's a popular Novel series out there that sort of did that isn't here?) but massive crossover series with new trek people.. I'm a bit meh.. but hey ya never know lol.

Anyway back to the Picard finale.. the whole fleet stand off didn't really excite me much at all (other than Picards noble sacrifice I mentioned earlier).. we saw those damn space flowers you saw me moaning about last time again haha, then they used that 'magical plot hole device' to generate duplicate Dr death faces and then the ships all with warp core illusions. Come on man this a advanced Romulan fleet, not those idiot half primitive Kazon in the Delta quadrant that fell for voyagers holograms but anyway.. this all lead to a rather amazing sequence where the evil commodore half Vulcan chick just kept preparing to fire and retargeting.. I think after the 5th or 6th time I actually yelled out (no BS I kid you not) at the TV "STOP PREPARING AND JUST FIRE THE F******** WEAPONS AT SOMETHING ALREADY!!!" hahahaha.

Then Riker shows up to give us some fan service. Kinda cool but once again just like with Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr 's reveal in the prev episode the delivery just.. felt.. wrong! Urgh. I mean I know he said he's on the active service list still but he's been retired for years and they just give him command of a huge fleet right off the bat, no admirals needed lol? They wouldn't even give Picard a crappy old science vessel but they'll give Riker a friggin fleet lol! I expected the admiral who swears a lot to be in charge of it to be honest. But hey's there's some fan service to be given here and I guess I should be happy Michael didn't try to kill him off too lol! I've seen people on the internet making fun of the obvious CGI background behind him too.. I can see why, as it doesn't look any better than the ones in the fan film Star Wreck, a movie made by a bunch of Finnish nerds in their bedrooms 20years ago lol (great film though haha). If we're wrong and that's a redressed discovery set or something then boy did they mess that up as it really looks fake lol.

And what the hell was going on with all the ships????? The entire romulan fleet was made out of 1 ship design plus a special capital command ship. These guys lost their homeworld and the vast majority of their population yet apparently they can afford to throw out all their old ships (except for that 22nd century Rom ship in ep 4 lol) and have a brand spanking new fleet lol. I mean this was the PERFECT opportunity to give more fan service and fill the fleet with old Valdors and D'deridex's.

Copy and paste a lot of that for Riker's fleet too. He warped in with 200 friggin ships that look the same.. what the hell!! When I think back to the giant federation fleets used in the Dominion war that were filled with old ships.. by then excelsiors would have been about 90 years old (at least the design anyway) and reliants and saratogas would have been over 110 years old. So why not stick some old galaxys, sovereigns and defiants in this fleet??

For a show that has a budget the old trek shows could only dream of I'm amazed that they literally built 2 giant fleets of the same ships using copy & paste.. Also was it just me or did the ships also look rather fake CGI looking.. they must have accidentally blown the budget out and run out of money.. that has to the be the reason for calling it in surely? The CGI DS9 fleets looked better than this for christ sake. That video you guys posted above pretty much confirms it lol.

Anyway then he just left... a dying Picard is like "oh yeah I can handle it from here Will".. and Wills like "sure bro.. I'll take all these ships we had to pull from vital missions and just turn around after being here for all 5 minutes" lol. If I was the Vulcan commodore chick I would have said "hey the federation is abandoning the planet again lets turn around and blow sh*t up before they come back again.. EVERYONE PREPARE TO FIRE SOME MORE!!!" lol.. Someone that obsessed aint gonna care about the treaty of Algeron. Also she's responsible for the deaths of everyone on Mars and most of the Romulan homeworld (by destroying the rescue fleet).. but nah its cool you can fly off lol.

Oh well.. I coulkd pick at a bunch of other things but I'll stop complaining haha.. time to move on! I'll probably still cop the hater title from some people who loved it but like I said before normally I love all scifi and am super tolerant and am often the one taking on the haters lol but this show (much like the new main star wars films) just rubbed me the wrong way from ep5 onwards.. I guess its because these characters that I grew up with mean a lot to me and I don't like seeing them having to run the Michael Chabon gantlet of death and misery.

At this stage I now actually prefer Discovery over Picard. Probably because they're not screwing with my beloved childhood characters as much haha which means I can tolerate more plot and technology gaffes. I thought they handled Spock and Pike pretty well in s2 and it really made the show so much better having them and the Enterprise there. So I worry a bit about Disco s3 as they won't have those improvements anymore.. however I'm super excited about the ST Pike show. At least they listened to the fans on that one!

 

[kjc733]

Not seen Picard and not reading the spoilers so won't comment on the plot.

However... the ships. I agree with Samuel (rare), they look unfinished and there's a lack of effort went into them. Even the render quality is somewhat lacking in places, some of those screenshots look straight out of STO. The ships themselves look like the STO Avenger class... just not as good. It's a shame as I think it wouldn't have taken much to do something special with these. That big bulky secondary hull is just crying out for a Vesta style deflector (and yes I hate the gaping space whale look but even so), it would have added so much character to the ships. The rounded nacelles also scream out for a few Vesta style influences. With just a bit of effort they could have fit in soooo much better.

And what happened to the whole "bigger is better" thing that has been plaguing Trek for the last decade? Yay, smaller Starfleet ships, great no problem with that. But you have to have a couple of big Warbirds, the Romulans invented overcompensating in ship design. What's with all the tiny fighter lookalikes?

 

[dvatreknerd314]

And what happened to the whole "bigger is better" thing that has been plaguing Trek for the last decade?

The Sovereign happened

 

[Hellkite]

No

The Borg happen post The battle of Wolf 359 ship were smaller and more tactical in over all design.

It was a paradigm shift in fleet setup that was reinforced in the Dominion War.

 

[Jetfreak]

Was bored, made some memes:

Romulan Spy, Engineering Team, Gemini Effect, etc.

---


On a more serious note, I liked how the finale gave some closure to the Picard - Data storyline left over from Nemesis, that felt meaningful and genuine for me at least. "Blue Skies". I'm still not sure about how to feel with Picard now being a Synth himself and that weird tentacle (Cthulhu) thing raises more questions that answers.

My suspicions were correct in the end, if you could just overlook that lousy-ass Arrowverse tier cringe writing and dank excuse for dialogue, there's something half decent on STPicard as a whole.

 

[dvatreknerd314]

Was bored, made some memes:

Romulan Spy, Engineering Team, Gemini Effect, etc.

if you could just overlook that lousy-ass Arrowverse tier cringe writing and dank excuse for dialogue, there's something half decent on STPicard as a whole.

I just stole this image btw.

I agree that Picard still has potential, and I know it takes a while to figure out the writers are crap and fire them find their footing, it's just a frustrating period in the show right now.

 

[dvatreknerd314]

So to go back to Episode 3...

Spoiler: Episode 3

Going through Trek uniform designs, I remembered this. Was anyone else not impressed by the 'interim' uniform? The uniform design worn by Picard as an admiral and by Starfleet officers around the time of the Mars attack? The visual design itself wasn't too awful in my opinion (except those cuffs), but the actual execution looked sloppy. The way the uniforms sat on the actors, especially while sitting, looked like the costume department put zero effort into them. I mean really, you're only talking about maybe two costumes! The contemporary ones looked like they were actually tailored, but not the interim ones.

 

[Jetfreak]

If anything, that design felt like a nod to the STO and "Countdown" comics uniforms, a sort of hybrid of the design. It's a very "style over substance" look, which calls back to the over-designed Admirals garbs from early TNG.

I dunno, there's just something about the fit and finish on the uniforms that comes across as sloppy. Almost fan-film vibe.

 

[CABAL]

I dunno, there's just something about the fit and finish on the uniforms that comes across as sloppy. Almost fan-film vibe.

They kind of look like a one-size-fits-all thing rather than the old tailored uniforms. Like when Generations borrowed the DS9 uniforms and they didn't fit quite right.

 

[Croatian Klingon]

Terrible show, on every level- storytelling, pace, characterisation, ship design, plot "convienience", just terrible... i hope covid-19 crisis will stop Bad Reboot writers from making season 2 of this s..t-show, like, forever!

 

[dvatreknerd314]

Terrible show, on every level- storytelling, pace, characterisation, ship design, plot "convienience", just terrible... i hope covid-19 crisis will stop Bad Reboot writers from making season 2 of this s..t-show, like, forever!

Don't be afraid to tell us how you really feel

 

[ISS_Enterprise_D]

In spite of several missteps and a number of decisions that I would absolutely have done differently and still ended up at the same point, overall I enjoyed where this show took us. I feel like we do need an interim Trek show between all this, though. Picard kinda just dumped us into the post-Nemesis world and gave us very little time to play catch-up through anything. And while certain scenes that were questionable in nature you know which one I'm talking about, I woulda been fine with that scene being there if we'd... gotten to know what that character was like a little more post-Voyager?

I dunno, despite enjoying a lot, this show was absolutely a mish-mosh of a lot going on and simultaneously very little in some places. I'm hopeful that Season 2 takes us some interesting places, but we definitely need another Trek show that gives us back an episodic look at the universe. I'm not saying that linear storytelling in Trek is a bad idea but 2 seasons of DIS and this 1 of PIC have made it clear that they need to be companion stories to it.



I will say however that one of the few things that genuinely irritates me was that Fed fleet at the end. That sequence goes into the "my headcanon overrules onscreen canon until otherwise" pile. Might have been an interesting ship if there weren't 200 of them just clustered together like that. I don't know the design team that gave us those cool lookin' Warbirds, nicely updated T'liss, good shots on the notNormandy and the Borg Cube and the Enterprise-D, also gave us those PS2 looking things.

 

[Candice Greene]

Yes, folks, it's time I chime into the 10 things that bothered the Hell out of me to wash my mind of Star Trek Discard Season Explicative

Spoiler

1). Character Assassination. No matter how you look at this, any Character from TNG that appeared is polar opposites in some way. One of my number one peeves, when was Picard, the Champion of Intelligent life, comfortable with the Federation creating Synthetic workers. May as well be an army of Androids. Matter of fact the whole idea of these Synthetics made no sense when you have all those CMark 1 Holograms that can do the same work. Either way, this old codger threw away all his convictions no matter how you look at it. Leave Starfleet? No, you go against their orders, recruit others, do the right and moral thing, but that Picard no longer exists. As far as the Rikers, that's not the Rikers. The Rikers are not likely to let a child die because of a synth ban. I'll go to the planet Baku, or disobey the ban, whatever I had to do for my child. If there is a way, I AM DOING IT! Then we got cooking a Pizza with Bunnycorn sausage? This is the same Riker who preached about this being the future where replicators were preferred over live food as it was more HUMANE, or maybe the writers forgot WW III, what the frack were we eating then, radiated cows? Even our culture today, we eat more Processed food than livestock, go figure. So the Rikers are evil clones as well.

2). Earth 2399? No Earth 2019, complete with all the social behaviors of any utopia. Racism is apparently alive and well, and probably every other social disgrace man has. Hell, there seem to be that even crimes as well. I mean how you have a massive explosion and it seems no one cares.

3). Smoking, Drug use, Alcoholism, Gruesome and totally unnecessary violence, and of course explicit language. All that was missing is Nudity.

4) Destroying fan favorites, such as Icheb who died the worse death after that torture we were kind of forced to see. Hugh, for the sheer reaction of losing him. A move I describe as, How can I really piss the viewers off. But it's worst, like Seven of Nine who seems to have a new affinity for Bourbon (Amazing the writers love drunks), and apparent Chakotay wasn't man enough for her to going full blown Bi...I guess if not Gay. As a Transsexual, I am insulted. As well, in the first 9.5 episodes, when da Frack did Raffi go Gay? Did we miss something?

5) The Romulans. Proof you did no kind of research to anything on at least a Memory Alpha site. You have turn a once Xenophobic enemy that loves interfering with it's so called enemies to have an advantage to KILL ALL SYNTHS! Which makes you wonder why share a Borg cube with outsiders? Who the hell are these pointy ear imposters.

6) General Oh, who is she. A Vulcan? A Romulan? A preistess? How did she make it into Starfleet to be chief of security? No one figured she had ANY Romulan connections? Why she needs Sunglasses?

7) MASS EFFECT. I never played the game, had no idea what it was, and now I know. Nice to know here are more fans who write for Star Trek, than actual Star Trek fans...if any.

8) Orchids...really...Orchids. Moonraker Maybe? I give up. How about the Fix-it device. Who needs synths to build ships when you have Fix-it! Who dreams up this stuff seriously. Maybe they have great drugs in the writer's room. Could you imagine Patrick Stewart having too much LDS?

9) The Holograms. I don't exactly hate them but notice, they only appear if Rios needs them. The General view throughout Star Trek has always been Holograms are tools, and they are not intelligent lifeforms. The only advocate they had, Captain Janeway had no choice but expand the Doctors program, but even we know despite their so-called friendship, the only reason to treat him as a person was we need a Doctor to get home. Which brings me back to why Synths? It makes no sense unless you ARE a Mass Effect fan.

10) Pure F#$king Hubris. When the season 1 says he wanted to piss off all us so-called SJW Star Trek fans, and waits until after the season to state this, he could have saved me a lot of time and told me this at the San Diego Comic-Con.

I hope I made my case and figured out that you can't fight them, they will do, what they will do. The sad part, I will die without ever seeing a bonafide 100%, into the 25th Century Star Trek series (I hate films, they suck) unless it's done by a fan production, because there seem to be no Star Trek fans are wanted in Hollywood.

 

[Hellkite]

It was a Okay show

Not a perfect show there is no such show.

No show can live up to our "fanboy/girl " head canons.

So No!
I'm not on the bandwagon of hate for this show for the life of me I just don't get the hate...

I dare say that I enjoyed it.

Because it was not the same old Dren it was not PC / PG up for tv broadcast. so it was more life like and ???

It's a good thing that we're here. Where we're friend not trolls to each other here

​

 

[Jetfreak]

I've honestly heard worse, from Star Trek Re*tard or Alex Klutzman and Bad Reboot being the usual insults thrown around in boards. Not to mention the strange 25% conspiracy theories being paraded by suspect channels like Midnight's Edge. Ewwww

I've always been a skeptic of that 25% Prime Theory because the image of CBS lawyers sifting through Trek blueprints, reading through encyclopedias and deciding what defines 25% different is peak mental gymnastics.

I think its sad for folks like Midnight's Edge to come up with grandiose theories to justify their dissatisfaction to a show. Again, shifting blame to others rather than their little perfect selves. YouTube reviewers have literally become unwatchable because of this and as a fan, you are always forced to pick a side. The judgmental tone is eerily unsettling from zealot fans, you're either a true Trekkie or drinking the kool-aid. Lord knows I've had those exact run-ins on DeviantArt.

A Kobayashi Maru scenario for sure, and a rite of passage I suppose.

 

[TUB_Husker]

Yes you are right, but a bit truth I see in the 25% thing.
I think it's obvious. Sevens Eye and Hand Borg Tech things, the cube, the ships and the galaxy ship with this ugly shader, the word XB, why not say Ex Borg? e.c.. I don't know perhaps they really think this is cool to redesign all. But about the Youtuber I agree with you! But sometimes it gives videos they present my view, like this
youtube.com/watch?v=jsgnyxpzlfY (sorry is a midnights thing video)
To make whole videos about rumors, I think is poor, it's not journalism, it's gossip.

 

[Blake00]

@Hellkite I've been participating in Picard threads in many forums and I can say its pretty light here. Not even close to the hate I'm seeing elsewhere. As @Jetfreak points out there's some pretty savage and personal stuff going on out there.

In this thread I feel like it's more expressing disappointment with all thing we feels were creative mistakes and bad decisions. Well other than @Croatian Klingon who possibly wants everyone at CBS to get Covid-19 hahahahahaha!!!

Been thinking lately about how the mass frustration with new Trek and new Star Wars is kind of similar to how 'book people' often hate movies and TV shows because they're super invested in the universe and felt the new media fell way short of what their imagination created while reading the books. I love GOT, Altered Carbon and The Expanse but you see people who read the books hating on them for skipping massive content and writing out important characters etc. Same thing happened with the Potter & LOTR films too although in those cases I WAS one of the 'book people' and I didn't hate them lol.

As someone has has watched every single episode and film ever made of all past incarnations of Trek (even the cartoon haha) it almost feels like I've 'read the books' and therefore have huge investment in the characters and universe. And of course a lot of people here actually have read a lot of Trek books that paint much nicer post show universes for our beloved characters by people who really cared about them (as apposed to Michael Chabon who wants to make every character f****ed up and miserable until they die horribly in front of us in a GOT wannabe style). So when we see a product where they've turned everything upside down in the universe, sacrificed fan favourite characters, used cheap rushed CGI copy & paste ships, rushed through important character & plot moments, and throw out continuity errors and plot holes that leaving people thinking they've got lazy writers, it feels like they've 'taken our books' and burned them lol.

However amongst all the dogs*** sometimes the right people who actually know what they're dealing with come along and create great content.

Eg for those god awful new Star Wars films we got Rogue One and The Mandalorian. Solo was good too but suffered slightly from all the behind the scenes turbulence.

Back to Trek amongst all the madness of Discovery we got some really great moments and characters with Pike, Spock & Number One on the Enterprise which has now led to fans demanding a Captain Pike series and getting it!

Hopefully all this madness in Picard will lead to a better season 2 with a completely different story, less doom and gloom BS along with Whoopi Goldberg and Robert Picardo making cool appearances. Although knowing our luck they'll bring them back, make them gay and cheaply kill them so the new characters (that many of us don't give a stuff about) can have a good crying session over the loss lol.

 

[Candice Greene]

It was a Okay show

Not a perfect show there is no such show.

No show can live up to our "fanboy/girl " head canons.

So No!
I'm not on the bandwagon of hate for this show for the life of me I just don't get the hate...

I dare say that I enjoyed it.

Because it was not the same old Dren it was not PC / PG up for tv broadcast. so it was more life like and ???

It's a good thing that we're here. Where we're friend not trolls to each other here

​

It's not hated as much as head-scratching and showing flaws in the story. I didn't even mention the 86 + X deaths. I mean what was the story here when you put it all together? The Romulans were right all the time? Sure as a fan, I got no use for the series, but if you like it fine. I don't criticize people for liking something. If anything I question what I saw, and what I saw I can't say was Pulitzer Prize winning writing, or decent Sci-Fi in my opinion, and that's all.

 

[Jetfreak]

As apposed to Michael Chabon who wants to make every character f****ed up and miserable until they die horribly in front of us in a GOT wannabe style). So when we see a product where they've turned everything upside down in the universe, sacrificed fan favourite characters, used cheap rushed CGI copy & paste ships, rushed through important character & plot moments, and throw out continuity errors and plot holes that leaving people thinking they've got lazy writers, it feels like they've 'taken our books' and burned them lol.

Oooh I love this bit. I really got irked with some scenes and dialogue that was needlessly aggressive in tone. Admiral b*itch swearing, folks talking down to Picard, questionable gore and whatever the hell was going on in that "brother-sister" act. As if Star Trek wants to play catch up with the gritty grim dark shows out there.

That's another one of my issues with PIC. Overcompensating. As if its scared and ashamed to be Star Trek and muddles in generic sci-fi cliches just to fit in with some imaginary cool woke crowd. I don't know if its an exclusively American thing, but this pretend to be socially-aware subtext is pretty grating in western media these last few years.

Anyway, behind the scenes ship info here:
https://www.thetrekcollective.com/2020/04/the-starships-of-star-trek-picard.html

 

[Blake00]

and whatever the hell was going on in that "brother-sister" act.

Now that's something I forgot to post about and haven't seen anyone else talking about until now. WTF was with that whole Romulan brother and sister incest thing.. if that's not a Game of Thrones wannabe act I don't know what is lol..

 

[Candice Greene]

Well I thought they showed us Klingon sex, and really wanted us to see Romulan incest.

 

[Majestic]

After watching the series (much like watching DSC) it makes me want them to continue the Kelvin time in a series. Yes it wasn't prefect but at least it didn't pretend to be prime universe and it did at some part keep the values of Trek, hope for a better future etc. That really is what Trek is supposed to be able, a brighter future, sure they have the occasional war, battle, death but it's not a dark science fiction, we have plenty other shows for that.

I seriously think the last trek incarnations have really lost what it is to be Trek and are just trying to profit on the name. Which is really sad and is a recipe for falling profits, disgruntled fans and eventually show cancelation.

Sure Star Wars had it's ups and downs but I think Episode 9 and the Mandalorian are two steps in the fight direction. I've yet to see Trek take a step in the right direction yet. Hopefully a Pike series would make that step or a Star Trek 4 or (JJ/Kelvin) series.

Either way I share a lot of the disappointment others have felt with Picard series.

 

[Candice Greene]

It's kind of like "I told you so" syndrome. We all got pulled in by one word, Picard and like discovering a new faith we had hope. More wee found out we dismissed the the the obvious and concentrated on the positive. Frakes, Ryan, Sirtis, the more familiar names we heard we were pulled in by our own imagination of what this series has and the promise of seeing Picard. Hell, they even mentioned more for season 2. Yet over time interest turned into disinterest. Production problems, the showrunner bailing after season 1, the changing and very extended premiere. The much lower budget, as well...A comic preview. Some of us lost faith, s well as excitement, but we're still curious. I mean how bad can it be?

It took me 6 episodes to give up on Discovery. I'm guessing since I did like some of the Characters I made it all 10 episodes. But ll the Hope, the faith, the familiar was dashed against the wall, and promptly raped of all the values that made TNG so enjoyable and replaced with the Bizzare, The violence, The language, the Character assassination, and a story that would make your entire writing staff look like Mass Effect fans with terrible ideas. I know that a handful of us had a feeling it would be bad...but not THIS bad. I said this after Star Trek III, and after watching this uncensored mess of modern Sci-Fi I will repeat it, and I will always say this to my dying breath. "Star Trek is a Television Series. It can't be translated to film, and it can't be stretch out into an Uncensored format with 10 episodes for something that can be solved in an hour.

I look at it this way, an analogy I heard. It's like we like Big Mac's, unchanged original recipe, and great tasting. But Hollywood, some directors, and Producers swear they know what we want, so they give us the line this is much better than a Big Mac, and you will enjoy it because it's better for you. Well, enjoy the Soylent Green, because we may not get a Big Mac for a Looooooooooooooooooooooooong time.

 

[Jetfreak]

Nah, the Trek conspiracy crowds will say its just a "big mac" that's 25% different.

Which is basically Jollibee where I'm from.

 

[Candice Greene]

Nah, the Trek conspiracy crowds will say its just a "big mac" that's 25% different.

Which is basically Jollibee where I'm from.

True but as Charleston Heston said, "Soylent Green is made from Dead people". After 86+X Body count in one season, I would rather be a Redshirt in the TOS. At least someone would give a crap I died.

 

[Jetfreak]

Really? Are people actually crazy enough to count the deaths per season? Or is this 86 number another random digit pulled out of their behind?

I'm pretty sure it would be in the billions if we count the offing of Romulus.

 

[Candice Greene]

Actually it only the on-screen confirmed deaths. X being the Borg sent to the vacuum of space but I swear they could survive it, but with all the rules broken thus far, nothing is the same. This does not include Picards Death or Data's for that matter, but yeah, there was a body count from Phasers, to Blades, to ripping one's face off.

 

[Blake00]

I thought Discovery season 1 was okay but there were many things that annoyed me. Season 2 was a huge improvement for me however that was mainly due to the additional cast members playing Pike, Spock and Number One on the enterprise, there was still some silly stuff (lazy writing plot hole things as usual) that annoyed me though. Season 3 loses those great additions so I fear it'll disappoint me again lol. My love of the Disco season 2 Enterprise content of course also leaves me super excited for Star Trek Strange New Worlds (aka the Star Trek Pike show fans demanded heh) as they've said it will be a more traditional episodic Star Trek adventure show on the Enterprise! So hopefully they can't screw that up too much... although there's some rumour (possibly BS) out there that it's also going to have a young bisexual Kirk running about in the show so read into that what you will lol!!

Back to good old Picard.. I've decided I'm not going to call it that anymore now. To me this show shall now be known as 'Patrick Stewart Goes To Space' (PSGTS for short) as there really isn't much Star Trek or Picard in it lol!!! I've been waiting for the 'Critical Drinker' to review PSGTS as I've become an fan of his after seeing his Last Jedi and Rise of Skywalker reviews on those cluster****s. Sure enough in the video below you can see he hates it and he talks about Picard himself being rather useless just like I talked about in my episode reviews earlier in this thread. Yes I know hating on stuff is kind of his gimmick haha but he makes good points that match a lot of my previously posted thoughts.


This is Patrick Stewart Goes To Space!

And this is Star Trek Picard baby!!

 

[Warhawk]

Though I've watched the entirety of TOS, TNG and the original movies, because I haven't watched anything Star Trek related since Nemesis, I think I'm in a good position to claim authority as a barometer for "what does someone from the outside think of this when they flip through the channels." And the truth is that when I passed by my father and brother watching it one day, I would have had no idea what it was if it weren't for the fact that marketing efforts had shoved in my face that Patrick Stewart was doing a thing. Nix him from the screen (as it was when he simply wasn't on-screen) and it was unrecognizable to me as a Star Trek setting. My impression was a bunch of angsty, over-acted young people who can't stop swearing, wrapped up in some EPIC superhero movie-grade plot that I already cannot take seriously because I can't take the characters seriously, and that was all before I saw Stewart portraying a mindless, bumbling fool with no command presence whatsoever. Even from the most basic sales point of view, it was possible for me to literally skip thinking about their entire trademark for the several minutes I was exposed to.

You can only get so far from the DNA of a franchise before it stops being that franchise. You can't go to a Taco Bell yet only be able to order pastrami. Star Trek, like any other mass-market bit of entertainment, has two strands in that helix: The original creative team/mind, and the original characters/actors/environment. Star Trek already lost both decades ago, and while you can claim some semblance of lineage after TNG, can you really tell me with a straight face that DS9 fit the pattern established by TOS or even TNG? How about Voyager? Enterprise? The TNG movies? No. Are they bad? No, not necessarily. But they aren't Star Trek anymore.

Corporations will continue to produce franchises because they're seen as "safe" investments. The details don't really matter, only the trademark. ("Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will.") Because of this, short of the original creative forces that made the thing in the first place, any actors and/or directors who really want to keep the flame alive or at least pour their heart into their work should be presumed to be the absolute exception, not the rule. We lucked out when DS9, Voyager and Enterprise had good writers for certain episodes. It was fortune that had a few actors really able to invest themselves into it. Eventually that luck runs out.

But this is a natural process, value-neutral. Nothing made by human hands lasts forever. Rather it's something to be kept in mind when differentiating between series/franchises and standalone works, just as you should discriminate between entertainment and art. Lack of discrimination is partially the cause of fan fiction: Fans detecting the potential for art and trying to rework the product into it. Yet everybody knows that it's "just fan fiction" because there's only so far you can take the setting before it stops being itself. There isn't much fanfiction based on, say, Cassablanca. Why? Because it didn't need it.

That's all I gotta say on it. Star Trek is a wagon train to the stars. "Picard" ain't.

 

[TUB_Husker]

can you really tell me with a straight face that DS9 fit the pattern established by TOS or even TNG?

Yes, here, I say this . I think DS9 is a consistent further development of TOS and TNG. It is more between black and white, the Motivation of the charackters are more complex and in cause of Dukat very ähm dynamic , but there is the utopian and the values in different views. The Trek ideals are held up even during the war. Values are not in vain, you have to fill them with content and that can only be trough deeds and how you do this deeds. And in DS9 this was always an issue, the struggle for values. Because of that is DS9 for or me the Star Trek pinacle.