MACO's Good or Bad?

[Majestic]

A friend of mine just recently said, that the most important thing he hated on ST:Enterprise was a para-military unit, comparable with the French GIGN or the Carabiniery or even more a future kind of the S.E.A.L.s.

Though being the MACO Co in the Midway RPG, I had some thought about it, while I was modelling a ship.

My point would be, that I actually think the MACOs were a good idea, but bad represented. The tactics were quite poor for such a special operations unit.
Contra would be, that in the Trek shows before, there were not the need for such a unit (except DS9, but that's another topic, I think), as even Kirk tried to solve problems peacefully.

I'll come up with more, but what are your opinions?
(Even considering such policy in the Trek universe anyway, would it be logic?)

Actually the MACOs make perfect sense. The only real problem people have with it is that they are closed minded. People just can't seem to be open to new ideas. This is the most illogical part of us humans. We have this problem to live in a false sense of security, and so we place ourselves in a little "box" by doing this.

A special ops team should have been part of Star Trek all along. But since it was introduced in the last series, people want to cry foul about it. People have this thing about trek that the federation is a bunch of goody goodies. But let's look at it this way, Humans are best at war. It seems that it's the only thing we are truely good at. So most likely, humans will not be the goody goodies that Trek portrays us to be. That's just an illusion to make the show different than others.

I agree with exactly what you said on all terms.

 

[_VARGR_]

I agree as well with yous. they seemed good on the terran empire eps sence it was a war and all. Hated the end of that ep with passion tho, was great right up until it.

 

[CrazyFrog1903]

MACO's are like all special forces. You never see them but you almost always owe your lives to them. Most Americans never think of the special forces that the USA has but there are several missions that they perform that we will never know about. So, the MACO's are completely needed. Just b/c they have never shown them in another series before doesn't mean they weren't there.

 

[Majestic]

MACO's are like all special forces. You never see them but you almost always owe your lives to them. Most Americans never think of the special forces that the USA has but there are several missions that they perform that we will never know about. So, the MACO's are completely needed. Just b/c they have never shown them in another series before doesn't mean they weren't there.

I agree with Zered here, they make the series more realistic and are a great addition to the Star Trek saga.

 

[EAS_Intrepid]

I actually think that Zered is right.
But how the MACOs operated sometimes frigthened me. Maybe it is to keep the storyline interesting when a few unnamed soldiers get stunned by the enemy boarding the NX-01, yes. But these situations are the point: For example, when they beamed aboard the Romulan probe (In "Babel" I think) the situation got tricky and they beamed the MACOs out first! Hey, these are Special Forces! First to go and last to leave! (okay, to keep the story going, but then send no MACOs or at least the Major of the unit!)

I think the MACOs are good in ENT (as I said before!), but how they scripted some tactics etc where nuts. Maybe it's just the lack of a REAL good scripter in ENT and not the MACOs...

 

[CrazyFrog1903]

The way the scripts went you could tell that the writers did not know exactly how to show the MACOs. Ofcourse I think the only people able to do that would be accuall special forces personal. But the writers atleast get a cookie for trying. LOL

 

[Eisenhower]

Humans are best at war. It seems that it's the only thing we are truely good at

Then why do you watch Star trek? I mean honestly, the problems you guys are complaining about have to do with the very basic underlying premise from TOS onwards so why even watch Star Trek at all. Its like saying, "I love Star Trek, but if only they could drop this Liberal,Utopian none sense then it would really be good" There are other Sci-Fi shows that have modern ethics/morality/flaws that take place in space.

 

[Hellkite]

Well Let me put it this way Frog is right "You never see them but you almost always owe your lives to them. Most Americans never think of the special forces that the USA has but there are several missions that they perform that we will never know about"

For the most part it is a good thing that it is not in the pubic eye.

But back to Star trek

"We deal with threats to the Federation that jeopardize its very survival. If you knew how many lives we've saved, I think you'd agree that the ends do justify the means."."

- Luther Sloan


The point is that the Maco and Section 31 for that matter fulfill a need in order for it the Federation to be ""Civilization""

The point even in the idealistic social construct of the Federation civilization is a beautiful but all to fin veneer.

This veneer that is all that stand between and the harsh realities of life should it falter we would see it all come crashing down around us.

Those of us that have seen this in real life "War". Know this all to well be it on the Fields of Battle or the air above them can testify to that first hand.


So no doubt the MACO are good and need very much need

 

[Ryderstorm]

Yes I agree with that Macos are very much needed etc. Though in Ent they were portrayed very badly quite often. I also think its a insanely dubious idea that the federation would not have Macos or some form of special Marine unit to deal with incidents. What I find most disturbing in the trek series is that for the most part with a few exceptions, security forces were portrayed badly or as incompetant. all the way from TOS into Enterprise...I find it very hard to understand how starfleet security officers seem to have the equivalent training of mall security guards for the most part.

 

[Adm_Z]

Yeah, the concept is sound, especially in a so-called Utopian society. It wasn't implemented very well, script wise, but there was definitly a need for an armed force aboard a ship of people who likely didn't take many combat lessons.

And just because your society is Utopian doesn't mean every other war-mongering species is. Why do you thing exploration vessels still have phasers and photons?

 

[Eisenhower]

I find it very hard to understand how starfleet security officers seem to have the equivalent training of mall security guards for the most part.

lol so true! Actually we do see federation "soldiers" in DS9, in the siege of Ar and when Jake goes to the front-lines in the fed war with the Klingons.

 

[thunderfoot]

Whoever was it that decided the Federation was a Utopian society? And where is the proof this is so? I never really caught the ENT bug, so I watched very little of it. I was very busy with a certain game at the time and found it much more interesting to play in the Star Trek universe than to watch it. Who says, that having a liberal bent is wrong? This makes no sense. Star Trek is supposed to represent the best part of us, is it not? Seems to me an organization devoted to preserving something this noble should be prepared to pull out all the stops to ensure this.

In Observation Point Alpha, near Fulda Germany on what we used to call the Inner German Border there was a sign which stated, "For those whom are willing to sacrifice everything for them, Liberty and Freedom have a special flavor the protected will never know and cannot appreciate." I see nothing at all wrong with Star Trek having something like MACO's. No matter how badly they may be portrayed. It would be silly to assume they did not exist in the Star Trek world prior to ENT. Or at all. Just because we cannot see them. Doesn't mean they are bad or evil or anything like that. Nor is it needed to be disrespectful towards something or someone who professes a view which has been commonly tagged as "liberal". Just because we may disagree with something does not automatically make it wrong or misguided. Humans being who they are we all want to aspire the best qualities we have. Unfortunately, Humans being who they are, not every one is interested in the common good and justice for all. And for us to deal successfully with the crazies, we have to have something like the MACO's. This is not a judgement, just an observation.